Deathroller & Big Guys

The trouble with B) is that halfing trees and ogre team ogres lack loner. Plus the Deathroller has no negatraits. Also mummies and Tomb Guardians are seen by many as big guys as they have ST5 and strength access only but lack loner or negatraits.

True, but having STR5 does not make a character a Big Guy. I mean it is possible for a Dwarf Blocker to get 2X a +1 STR upgrade in his career, but that does not make him a Big Guy; it just makes him a strong (STR5) character.
Imo Mummies and Tomb Guardians aren't giants (Big Guys) either, just strong.

As for Treemen in 1/2ling teams and Ogres in an Ogre teams, when you go for game balance it is only fair that they do not suffer from the Loner trait also.
At least when it comes to BB.
Sure in DB the 1/2ling and Ogre coaches get a slight advantage when their Treemen or Ogres do not suffer from the Loner trait, but when you compare the chances of a 1/2ling or Ogre team winning to say a Chaos team or Dark Elves team you gotta admit that the odds are stacked against them (with or without Loner).

I’d certainly agree that the fanatic shouldn’t count towards this rule as he has 2 serious hindrances (random movement and being auto KO’d minimum when knocked over).

In my eyes the Fantic isn't even a BG; to me a BG must at least meet all the 3 standards I've described in my previous post conserning BGs.

Simple, Big Guys are every starting ST5 player exept the fanatic.

Simple, Big Guys are every starting ST5 player exept the fanatic.

Uhm, no not every starting ST5 player is a Big Guy, to me Big Guys have to do with size and not ST. It used to be that every BG's base was bigger than normal (non-ST5) Characters. To me it makes perfect sense that a small character (the size of a Snotling) can possess (read: start with) ST5 and NOT be a BG (like the Fanatic).
Heck, in the beginning of DB a BG could not enter a 1 Sq wide corridor because his base didn't fit in there (and if I'm not mistaken 3 snotlings could fit on the base of 1 normal-sized character).

To simplify it: Big Guy does not automatically mean being a strong guy, simply because not every strong character has to be big.

mummies/tomb guardians are not big guys, mummies take their whole move just to stand, TGs have decay so die pretty easy when beaten up.
big guys have loner.

as for treemen, even fling ones get rooted and then are basically useless as who is going to knock them down to unroot them unless you want to get past them easier?

rules should be as original, max of 2 loners. this works when big guy teams come out (as they shouldnt have loner).
the rule as it stands screws over goblins, undead, tomb kings and ogre teams and is not the rules as they should be

Honestly can't believe that I didn't get one response to my proposal. It solves every major problem at hand and is true to the 2nd and 3rd edition backgrounds (at least I don't recall ever seeing a team that had both trolls and minotaurs, or one with ogres and yetis). You're as bad as the French! (wink applies to the last statement only)

For me i simply don't play any matches against a DR from now on. Its boring. If I am in MM and I see one, my opponent gains double mvps before the match starts...

100% agree... I don't even feel like playing matches which have a Deathroller in it. You can be as determined as you want to be in pushing the DR into a pit, but I am an average coach just trying to get better. The DR simply frustrates me and I lose the interest in playing Dungeonbowl whenever I'm matched up against one.

The fact that the deathroller controversy has such a big thread in this forum and nothing has been done to nerf it is not good news, and possibly a bad omen for things to come.... (I'm sure Darkson would agree with me there )

Too bad because I really enjoy the game except for this one glaring deficiency.

This is bad news indeed. I mean, why would you sell a game in which one of the main interests rests in being able to field 3 different races, and then making this 2, and hoping we don't realize? Come on already...

100% agree... I don't even feel like playing matches which have a Deathroller in it. You can be as determined as you want to be in pushing the DR into a pit, but I am an average coach just trying to get better. The DR simply frustrates me and I lose the interest in playing Dungeonbowl whenever I'm matched up against one.

Are you telling me that you still can't outbash a 1/2ling team with a DR even if you were coaching a Chaos team with a Minotaur and 4 ST5 Chaos warriors?
Okay, I admit that getting to the point where all your Chaos Warriors get STR5 might be a challenge but if your Minotaur gets Claws 1st then a DR should not be that much of a problem.
Heck, once the Werewolves get in with their MV8 & claws it's pretty much game over for the DR.

Or the Gutter Runners who can easily outrun anything to score a quick TD.
Heck, even on large maps the Gutter Runner would be op imo.
When they've chosen the right mutations they are op on any map ( MCHammer's "Can't touch this" should be heard every time a Gutter Runner enters a dungeon)

[Tristelune]

Yes I want a gutter runner with two head, and I will see the head of the DR alone on a corner of the dungeon

since when are gutter runners that good? they are 1 faster than a wardancer, dont have block or leap as standard and are ST2.

yes once they skill up and get leap, very long legs, sidestep and block they are awesome but as you only get 1TD per match in DB skilling up takes a long time, unlike BB where your runners can level up in 1 game easily